#072 Anger & Anxiety in the Family with Dr. David Hanscom (Part 2)

In this episode of The Less Stressed Life Podcast, I had the pleasure of interviewing noted spine surgeon, Dr. David Hanscom. After 32 in practice, Dr. Hanscom retired and focused on a new mission: to re-introduce true healing into medicine. Dr. Hanscom is a firm believer that doctors should be given the time to listen to and understand their patients. He knows that life situations surrounding your medical problems have a tremendous impact on your care and ultimately your outcomes.

In this episode (part 2 of 2!), Dr. Hanscom coaches me a bit on releasing stress and anxiety around family dynamics and some tools for a happier family life. He explains the connection between anxiety and surges of body chemicals and shares how to train your body to control these surges--even when the stress comes from your kids and family.

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Transcript

spk_0:   0:00
welcome to the less stressed life podcast. This is your host, Krista Bigler, Private practice, Integrated nutritionist helping people across the U. S. Reverse digestive issues. Exuma and Auto Immunity via phone and video. Consult toe, learn more. Visit less stressed nutrition dot com Now onto the show. Okay, so today, on the Lester's life, we have part two with Dr David hands calm last week. We're having a great time talking about anxiety and the paradigm shift around anxiety, which we're about to discuss. However, we didn't get into the family dynamics because a topic like this not only affects kind of your own personal health, but maybe what's going on all around your some of the things that we think about a stressor. So while Dr David Hans Calm spends most of his life as a successful orthopedic spine surgeon, he also spent a significant time of life working through the intricacies of anxiety and panic attacks in his own life. And after decades of trial and error, he determined much of what we identify with as anxiety can be addressed by reducing levels of stress hormones point blank. As a result, he helped many of his patients correct their own back pain by helping them correct their levels of stress and anxiety. And as this was the most rewarding work of career, Dr Hans come retired to spread this message as a protocol called Direct Your Own Care. He's the author of Back and Control. A Surgeon's Road Map out of Chronic Pain and the forthcoming book Do You Really Need Spying Surgery? And last week he mentioned, I'm gonna write about the family dynamics do because it really affects them, and that's what we're gonna chat about today. He'll explain the connection between anxiety and surges of body chemicals and tell us how you can train your body to control these surges even when the stress comes from your kids. Welcome back.

spk_1:   1:48
Thank you very much. Conversation Last time looking for today.

spk_0:   1:52
Okay, so so do we want to recap stress and anxiety responses first, before we talk about how you know when you're talking about spine surgery, Suddenly we're talking about families. Maybe let's talk about the big picture first, recapping stress and anxiety response and specific stress hormones and neurotransmitters like what happens when your body is under stress of all time?

spk_1:   2:16
Well, here's the way every living creature survives is their processing century. And put with your cat or a dog or a lion or whatever you are. You're processing the environment every second with sensory input from your eyes and ears, et cetera, and you're acting your way to remain safe is how we survive and humans have the same response. Where we're assessing environment, we're looking for physical threats. The species of creatures who didn't pay attention to the environment Accused didn't survive. It really is survival of the most anxious, most alert that actually who we are by definition, over millions of years of evolution. What happens is that this is not psychological. So you have humans have a bit of a problem. We have consciousness and call the curse of consciousness. So if you're faced with a physical threat, your body says danger, you take evasive action. Danger resolved your stress, chemicals go down. But what happened to stress chemicals? Increase your chances of survival because they increase your heart rate. They sent on the blood supply to your stomach. So, you know, wasted energy There you're more alert, etcetera, etcetera. So what happens? It doubles your nerve conduction So it happens. You're more apt to survive because your body is on high alert and ready to a spike when your body's full since eat. What if all the stress chemicals humans have a word for the sensation called anxiety is just a description? Every levels of trust chemicals were lying on the beach and relaxed. Everybody's full of serotonin and dopamine, the plate chemicals. You feel relaxed, but you wouldn't call relaxed. A diagnosis correct and something anxiety. It's not a diagnosis, either. Sister description. Your body's chemical state. If there's one message I want to get out of the world, is that that Survivor responds, called anxiety it simply intensively. A measurement of your stress chemicals. The unconscious brain processes 11 million bits of information a second. Do you how much the rational brain processes?

spk_0:   4:19
Much less

spk_1:   4:21
right, so it's 40 versus millions. What happens is that this message to private response every living creature has we tend to identify are with her and crying because it feels unpleasant. Remember, this sensation generated by a threat is intended to be extremely unpleasant because he compels you to take action to survive. Humans have the problems that the conscious brain has thoughts. Thoughts on that show been shown to go to the same region of the brain the same chemical result. But you can't escape your thoughts. That's a major problem, because what happens? Every human being is subjected just to so much sustained those the stress chemicals. And there's a study called the Ace Study called Average Childhood Experiences that they've known for years in the adverse childhood experiences are our Is Edem Huge Research project. Kaiser Study 1996 17,000 Patient So silly Took printing to collect physical, sexual emotional abuse Parent jail parent drugs Exeter. Stuff like that's just a score. They found out if you're a score was three or higher, you had a shorter lifespan. Higher disease, anxiety, depression, suicide, obesity. All these things went up. So my question to you is why she come from county childhood. You grew up, you've learned your lessons. Why would your life span be shorter? Because having a pleasant childhood

spk_0:   5:50
Well, don't you kind of present like Do you have these learned behaviors through your unconscious right? Like what you experienced as a childhood manifest as an adult?

spk_1:   6:01
Absolutely. That is the answer by the way because what happens in time? You're anxious. You're frustrated. Something in the president said danger. Well, you learn the danger from your past. If you scared my cat ones, next time you're a guest in my house, my cast not not gonna want to be around you, right? They remember humans have the same capacity. We, of course, a lot more sophisticated. But in an unpleasant childhood, things were dangerous. He had a right to be afraid because things were dangerous. You weren't safe. And so what happens is that more things in the present reminder things from the past. In time, you're anxious. He Bart is saying danger. You're stressed. Kim calls her up assistant anxieties who I am just realized that your survival mechanism that's much, much stronger than who you are. And what happens is that without the survivor, because you won't survive, it's much stronger than your conscious brain. I asked my client Say, look, visualize A thermometer on the opposite wall of the room when you feel anxious is usually just a moment of going up. So I'm nervous. I'm afraid I'm scared. I'm paranoid. There's different levels of anxiety, right? So it happens the way decreasing Jenny course. You decrease to trust chemicals, but I'd have your anxious or frustrated. You've been triggered in the present by something in the past that seem dangers or was dangerous, too. That's how we survive. So always interpret centuries. But so since humans can escape your thought, every one of us is under a long term chemical assault. Those ways of solving that. And I'm not sure it's the topic we want to go through today as we think we talked about that last time. But they were the key issue as faras decreasing anxiety decreases stress, chemicals. It's not a cycle political issue.

spk_0:   7:53
Okay, I have a few questions.

spk_1:   7:54
You fall for me so far?

spk_0:   7:56
Yeah. Do you want to just keep going? I was gonna ask if you had to psychoanalyze your own past to figure out what was causing those stressors for you. I mean, did you uncover that? That was a piece or did you? I mean, do you acknowledge it and then move on?

spk_1:   8:09
Yeah. You had to be aware of it and move on because what happens to Maury and a lot I should There's someone missing over and psychology right now that the boy understands something that somehow you're going to solve it. The problem is, when you're a plasticity standpoint, is that the more you talk about it? Yes, you reinforce it. It's a huge problem.

spk_0:   8:28
Okay, We need a change. Got it. Um,

spk_1:   8:31
so awareness is great. So

spk_0:   8:34
Oh, I was just going to say, you know, you were talking about you have these these thoughts. So I was thinking I'm always jotting notes is people are talking and I wrote, so you have to change your thoughts, but that I don't know if that really works that Can you just say you can change your thoughts? Because people that feel, um, basically hobbled by this feel that their thoughts are to their control. Not just that if you're talking about changing your thoughts and that's in your conscious brain and your unconscious brain has a much bigger hold on you designed even make sense.

spk_1:   9:06
So what happened? You can't control your thoughts, but you can separate from them. There's a very simple exercise that we talked about last time called expressive running. Is it be? Write down your thoughts on a piece of paper. You tear him up. Now you're turning up for two reasons. One of them is to destroy it with freedom. But the second reading, which is born important, is actually to not analyze them. They're not who you are. They're just thoughts. And so it happens. You're not gonna get rid of these thoughts because there's trillions of thoughts, but just simply separate it from your thoughts. That simple right exercise has been documented over 1000 research papers to be effective, different forms of intercourse. So that's the starting point. So the way decreases stress chemicals is directly with Michael's meditation relaxation, but the other way is neural plasticity. Were you instead of being stress automatic survival response, which is the stress? Chemicals is stress, little bit of a space that you make it choice. In response, you start methodically making different choices. You're literally changing the structure of your brain. You're rewiring your brain, so it's called neural plasticity and positive thinking somewhat of a disaster because you suppress your thoughts. But posit substitution is sort of a big deal. So it's awareness, separation, reprogramming Ah, more sophisticated way of awareness, separation. Reprogramming is forgiveness, becoming a world you're angry become what it's doing, become aware the chemical response and for giving us a separation process. Then one of the reprogramming tools, which is the opposite of anger, is play. So when you're a playful about chitosan and dope, him and you feel great. Generally, the one essence of enjoying your life is your stress, chemicals or not a relaxation chemicals, but your sense of well being essentially dependent on your body's level. Stress chemicals. It turned out that the mental pain is much bigger problem than the physical pain, because you can't escape it, but that mental pain gives you sustain the levels of stress. Chemicals is translates into physical symptoms, but jump into the family as far as this part of the attempted the family issues. Is that your difficult past? You come from a county childhood. You tend to actually become partnered with your darkest, deepest pattern because of the most familiar. So these family pattern start playing out in your new family and what we found out about three years ago in our pain project. As we watch 100 patients get better through a self centered process, but also became clear that the trigger, the family triggers are the biggest problem. It was a triggered. Somebody says something that just upset you. Well, it turns out that you could say something to me that upsets me. But I would have sent my wife because it means nothing to her. So when you see something upsets me, is that nothing to do with you? There's something in my past I get reminded of your statement tone of voice winter it waas. So you triggered me. So it's a trailer. That means you're anytime you're anxious. You're frustrated, you're traer. So what happens? Thes family patterns play out in your new family with your partner or your spouse, but also your programming your kids to have the same behaviors that you have. You can talk all you want. You intellectualize do this this and this but what they're learning and not intellectually, by the way, you're simply absorbing your reactions to the world. Jeff, you're angry or frustrated. Guess what? That's what they're gonna learn. So the situation is you being frustrated when they're confirmed it with it. That's what they're gonna learn to do, right? Simply a programming issue and all the quote detective education is gonna work it out, because in that what you're doing, you're telling that this is dangerous. Just by example, they have this massive survival response soon say, don't do this. This and this for saw their abstract gray hasn't developed yet. But second of all, you don't this massive survivor response that they don't know to do it. So we found out that the family triggers are the trump card. When the most ironic, perverse part of the human human condition is that the DP relationships, the deeper the trailer's right. We honestly never found one couple in our three years that we did it with my nurse. In my steam, every couple is triggered. It's part of human existence, so it blows relationships apart. Isn't lack of communication is not like a common interest, common life together, It's a It's a neurological trick. Has nothing do with rationality? Could you do with the unconscious reactions that are very, very powerful? We developed a set of rules around the family structure that made a huge difference. Now just review those very, very quickly, but this is not my book. My books back in control a certain room about a chronic pain. The family stepped us emerge a couple years ago. It's on the website. Go to my website under Stage one, which is back in control dot com. Right below the steps. It says Click this link to begin your healing journey with your family and there's a whole bunch of website posts on this thing. But what we learned essentially is that official. Everybody's triggered. You could do all the treatments in the world to decrease your pain, but if you're triggered, it goes out the window. So we ask families to start with four things first will say Look, I know you're in paying, but I want everybody in the hospital to be participating in the project. That means everybody reads the books that old enough to cover in the process. Do the writing relaxation. Do the tools outline the website, but to do it separately? No shit responses. I want to do it. It is what it is. You can't control it from the to do this, but each person sees their own journey, saying the bosses like how you put up a concrete wall metaphorically between the two of you as far as your pain. So no talking about your pain. Which means, by the way, no comm Plenty. Remember physical pains? One thing mental paints another, but they both kill is a part of the brain. So don't complain about your kid. You complain about your spouse or complain about politics wherever is. No complaining the same rules.

spk_0:   15:03
Very pie like that rule. Yeah,

spk_1:   15:06
just don't know complaining which the corner that that is also on Li Listen. So when the homework advice again my parents is, too when you go home the next month, I don't want to give one piece of advice. I want youto on Li listen in their eyes open, wide open. You know what? And somehow his parents think we're supposed to give her kids advice, a role as parents and a family. By the way, this book out and I recommended the world called Parent Effectiveness Training by Dr Thomas Gordon. A radio on my son was two, and I certainly wasn't the perfect parents, but I don't sound preachy here, but my son will tell you is now 35. He never was officially disciplined ever, but at the same time, we were very strict parent and somehow parents take on the pair of this, the child I need and I'm supposed to just from this person. That's why not. How you develop healthy relationships is that you have disciplining your spouse. You're not disappointing. Your co workers liked you. Discipline your child. What this book does, it takes you to a human to human existence. It just transformer left. That book has had the most impact on my life. Is anyone book cover? So she let go home and just listen and then really develop a true relationship with the kids. They're having a parent child label on it. Just go human, a human in truly play to have a good time, truly make your needs and own that. They make their needs known. Negotiate a way to live together but really howto live. Learn how to live together in harmony because if you're angry and frustrated, there's a process called mirror neurons. Then when you smell the baby, the baby spell respect, correct. It's not because the baby's happy, is it because you stimulated that part of the baby's brain. They do research on football fans that watching football quarterback threw the football. The throwing center lights up in the fans brain or when somebody last other people laugh or somebody onto the people on yon. That's mirror neurons. So he walked in the door after work. You've had a bad day and you're upset. What if he did this to your family? Especially if you're in pain

spk_0:   17:12
the opposite of smiling in a baby, that's for sure. Yeah.

spk_1:   17:15
So what you've done you actually still into the part of the brain and then your kids? Since that that's you. Look, one of the rules is that you're gonna create a safe house if you If you get triggered and need to argue or fight, take it outside. Don't create an absolute roll. This silly argument are fighting to take is gonna go outside, make these four walls your safe house, no matter what.

spk_0:   17:41
That'll be fun for kids. They're gonna argue and fight. I can send him outside. That's what you're

spk_1:   17:46
absolutely Let me have a right to go home and be a piece, right? Your kids. So if you upset your one of your kids and the kids have a right to know what you have said it when your three kids you have a right to enjoy. They have a right to dry their evening without it being disrupted with you. Argue it's one of your kids, right? One of the nurses I worked with back he's had to page or 16. 17 and I started argue if I should just send it to the garage and just take it outside. And obviously the argument could cut way short. And it doesn't. Everybody's gonna get traer Dhe. But what happens if you start really understanding the mirror? Neuron of fact? It is powerful, but you're not doing it as a minute winner of toll and truly happy. Truly happy. See your family? Whatever started bar ruling that really work? Have you done differently? Depending, too, of course, is not gonna work. So this is actually learning to really enjoy your family? Really understand. Become aware when you're tired, you're not gonna get rid of the trailers. They're always gonna be there. What else have little scene? That I said to myself, is no action in a reaction, it was treated or upset. I've learned even leave the room or a zip it or both. Boom. You have center angry. Guess what it's on Lee Destructive, right? Anything you say very angry. Upset is actually going to be only this trick up, especially to your kids who are dependent on you, one of them. So I'm just curious from your perspective how it lands on you when I say, Look, no advice, No complaining on Lee Lesson. How does that feel?

spk_0:   19:22
You know, it reminds me when people say things that reminds me of something right? And I think about my mom almost giving advice to nauseum, right? And how some of my family members still call for that advice all the time. But I will not be looking for that advice now because I grew up with that. It might be natural for me to give that advice. I'd have to think about it for a moment. You know, I think I do give it to my oldest child sometimes, and that's probably in. Actually, she is much more mature than I am. She is a better listener, and so and she's actually had that assignment. She's gone through some classes where she was doing some, like childhood education, things where her job was to only observe right and not do anything just observe, And I remember her telling me about the project was just last year and she said it was really enlightening an eye opening again, more mature than I s. Oh, it's actually kind of funny, because if I if I tell her this, she would say, Oh, you're gonna be you're going to learn a lot from that And I mean, I could I could learn a lot from just observing her right. I could. She is a great role model for me, so that's it makes me think of it doesn't really create heat. I love tools that take me out of any anger, right? Because it's easy to feel triggered because I grew up with with some of that rag rope I actually watch other parents now. Howto had a little bit of a shift of my own this summer where the kids were being so not he hunted, Trippi said, Well, we're not going to go to this museum anymore. We're gonna go home. And so I kind of implemented a a different structure, were basically and, uh, summarize it quickly. Basically, the big change. Waas. When we have an issue, we're just gonna count it out when we have a quick time out and they're gonna let it go and just we're not gonna deal with it anymore. It's over. And that was that was that was the big key. It was letting go of something and not stewing on something. So in the same way you said, when you talk about something, you let it fester and then it becomes like a longer It's hard to enjoy your family when you are. And sometimes you just can't rationalize with little kids anyway. So the idea. I'm just chuckling in my head about throwing them outside, you know, when it's snowing. But we have a great brash and it's very funny. If you go to the garage, there's no way you're not gonna be having fun. There's lots of fun stuff. So anyway, my point is, is that I that the Children used to I used to say this caused a lot of stress for me, right, Like leaving the office going home. Walking into the environment was stressful because of like not listening and et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. But once I decided to let go of stewing on something right, because it was a tool I had. It changed my levels of stress. Like I just like it went down completely. I didn't have I didn't feel those feelings. I love the idea of saying, Well, we're just not gonna fight, like making that announcement. Guys, we're not gonna fight you. If you're gonna fight, you have to go to the graduate to be great, because that's still you know, if they're gonna. Because this is how kids don't know how many kids you have. Um, David, But I've got, you know, to when they're kind of close of every kid wants to poke at each other, right? You know, I have a lot of I I like everything. You're saying it all sounds really good, but I threw the week before we talk, you know, between our chats and I was thinking about family dynamics, I was thinking, Well, what if this What if this a lot of this, But if you just say Well, no fighting e guess it just it ends a lot of the talking points,

spk_1:   22:31
right? But think about it carefully. I mean, when did you ever actually solve anything in a fight? Never,

spk_0:   22:39
Never,

spk_1:   22:40
never remember okay, we talked about Come back. Things are the issue. So again to your list. There's anxiety is just simply the state of your body chemistry. The point actually hit me just last couple days. Is that who we are as humans as individuals is actually the rational brain. And so you had This rational brain is being crushed by unconscious brain. That's why humans active center, terrible way with the hero patterns when actually know better because they're just being crushed by this overwhelming sense of anxiety. Once you can separate from it, then you can actually allow your rational brain and your individuality creativity to thrive in love. You can't imagine, but that's what you are. You're not just survival response. You are you, which is the rational brain. So if you take the energy of your ration rain and try to squish or deal with this as a survivor, respond, it's a bit. It's a bad deal again. Use the word elevated stress chemicals instead of the warning. Sonny, remember the antidote. Anxieties control. Something creates a threat. You control a situation or take evasive action. Once the situation is solved, then you should go back to normal state of chemical existence. But I can't do that. I can't. So if you can't control the situation like chronic pain, for instance, or your thoughts thereby kicks in war stress chemicals in an effort to regain control and you become angry, angry, It's just a survival motion. It's only about you. It is destructive. It is on Lee destructive.

spk_0:   24:08
I think about, you know, this is a lot can. Control is a huge worried, isn't it? Right? So if you cannot control it, then you become angry and then it festers. Is that correct?

spk_1:   24:19
Yeah, well, you know, anger does work. If you're being physically threatened and you're trapped, secretes more stress chemicals on animal. Can't put a word on it. But you've watched a trapped animal, and there they look angry, right? I mean, they're baring their teeth, their hair's bristling. I mean, they're really, really aggressive. They're angry now. They don't have a word for it. Humans get angry, but again are thought to be the same chemical action. So it turns out again the mental pain is way bigger problem in the physical pain, because again the others sustained elevated levels of stress chemicals, people physically gets sick. There's over 30 different physical symptoms that arise for being chronically stress, including, by the way, autoimmune disorders. There's a major research paper on a sweet note on over 3000 people in a registry, sure, in a virgin, very directly now between chronic stress and autoimmune disorders because it changes the history levels.

spk_0:   25:12
Yeah, I've never talked to anyone with an honor me and condition. They didn't have a big underlying foundation of stress. So sorry, Dinner. It changes histamine levels. Tell us about that because people don't always know what that means, even though they're familiar with it.

spk_1:   25:24
So basically, every day you have catch yourselves in your body, they're foreign bodies. Your immune system picks him off just fine. You have bacteria that come into your bloodstream from you're brushing your teeth. Whatever. I get immune system treats. Um, just get rid of him. And the reason why we stay alive is because of our immune system. Fighting off all these invaders, there's actually think there's more to the number of bacteria in the gut is beyond is trillions. I don't remember exact number, but at the same time, you know the bacteria bacteria in your gut actually produce serotonin, they had to depress it. They also produce melatonin. So we developed this truce with the environment, including bacteria infection, cancer cells accepted. The loss is to stay alive. It's all because of our immune system. And people have cancer. They have chemotherapy. There's called a graft versus host reaction, where based people, like people in cancer die under chemotherapy is there your immune system fails in the dive infection, right? But so is really create elaborate immune system. Then, also, my friends that that have died of cancer were under horrible stresses the year before they got their cancers. Because again, you know, you and I have cancer cells and alleged age got picked up by the immune system. So you're full of stress chemicals that compromises the histamines and is being very simplistic. Yours don't know as well as I'd like to, but the bottom line is there's a whole field of neuro immuno physiology showing the effect of the environment on the immune system and again, these alterations in your honor gnomic nervous system in your body. Chemistry has a tremendous effect on your ability to fight off infection, and actually take care of yourself.

spk_0:   27:03
I haven't heard anyone use the word neuro immuno immuno physiology in a while. Thank you for bringing that to turn back.

spk_1:   27:10
Yeah. Any question in the diet trail? Well, it's a big deal. I mean, you are what you eat. And so again the process is spooked. Find out, Just cripple the inflammatory response. And I'm sure they cause inflammatory response. But they also compromised immune system also, which again, in a different bit of a problem,

spk_0:   27:26
this is gonna affect someone's mood, which people don't always believe. But it can,

spk_1:   27:30
right, going back to their rules. That family just get very concrete about this. Please let my website, I mean, has been remarkable how powerful it's been to understand that the families that trump card through the deepest triggers the most powerful. It's also the most illogical. If you love your kids, why would you yell at him? Right? You would do anything for your kids this until you're being triggered. And again these trailers mean this massive survival response compared to your rational brain. It's incredibly distressing of these people that you're close to Your lovely were connected to him. But then the trigger new because again, you programmed your own triggers, Right? You've programmed your kids to behave in a way that you d'oh! And you are true By the way your parents behave because it's just a generational programming problem. It is not psychological. So going back to the physical symptoms people are saying, Well, you see, in my honor me disorder psychologically enter is no your autoimmune disorders because your body's chemistry is off and it stays out. That is not psychological.

spk_0:   28:32
I was pondering that. Sorry for the positive. I was thinking I was thinking through I was thinking through how I should ask. Actually, old hoods, maybe, I don't know. Maybe I'll just refer him to this episode.

spk_1:   28:45
Right. OK, so what was the question again?

spk_0:   28:48
It wasn't a question I was pondering out loud. I always think I'm a learner. And so I like to take this information and take it back to practice. Right. I was thinking, I don't really ask people about their childhoods, but me, I don't care about their childhood. Maybe I just want them to know that it can be this trigger in their condition, right? So maybe I'll just refer him to this episode?

spk_1:   29:06
Yeah. I mean, the thing is, what I was actually in my chronic pain situation. I was extreme anxiety and went from being a fearless surgeon to have anxiety. And one day it makes no sense, and I treat anxiety. Psychologically. I went to 13 years of psychotherapy and not against san therapy by any means. But the problem is, I was in the paradigm that the more I understood my problem somehow I was going to solve it or didn't realize I was actually we reinforcing the responses and the better for, like to use for, you know, instead of what it was. No presages awareness, separation. Reprogramming what? What? What I needed to do was become aware of this separate and to just create a vision for my life. Wouldn't want my life to look like and just execute So with your family. Could trying to fix your family's problems to say what you found What you want your family of the client. How do you want to execute it with things? Do you want to do their fun? What hobbies you want to do, How you want to give back? How do you want to structure your meetings, have a weekly family meeting, for instance, about how you want to run your family. It's like a business, right? But just be methodical, systematic about It's not a big belief system. It's not a huge philosophy. It's just the way the brain works. So again, with distrust, relationships both with partners but also with kids is a neurological trip, just a traitor. And again, those triggers are powerful and they're extraordinarily destructive.

spk_0:   30:31
I was wondering you went through these years of psychotherapy and then you kind of landed on. I mean, he didn't really land, but you pulled this together that basically anxiety is elevated stress hormones, and you need to decrease it. But you just talked about anger increases the same stress hormones and neurotransmitters that you know, the stressed us essentially right, cause it's like in theory, there's not a difference. So were you

spk_1:   30:55
the flip that statement. So anger is a measure of higher stress chemicals over his anger. Does it causes stress? Chemicals? Anger is the stress chemicals?

spk_0:   31:05
Yes. Okay. I'm wondering how you came up. You know how you came into this where you're just like learning about stress chemicals and you realized, Oh, these are all happening from these emotions. So therefore, if I turn these off than all these emotions and proof, I don't know,

spk_1:   31:20
I just I mean to me, Lily, 15 years. I think about this tax and come up with the sequence. And I mean, I always saw the anxiety was a problem, but I thought was anxiety of psychological. Jimmy Anxiety was one of those causes. They create so much disruption in your body. What did it realized? Anxiety was the result of the century and put anxiety. Wasn't the sentry input? Thoughts are input again. You can escape in that create the same chemical reaction. Psychology comes into play because you can. That's what cognitive behavior therapy does it teach. Your destructor thought patterns allows you to see how law they are that allows you to substitute or another one called acceptance. Commitment therapy allows you to have the thoughts you just to be with him. There was Remember, stress isn't the problem is the reaction to it. It's a chemical reaction. That's the problem, right? Stresses stress. It's stressful being alive. What you're trying to work on is a decrease that chemical reaction to it causes a chemical reaction, increasing a comfortable feeling that you can't tolerate. So again, I was a master suppressing anxiety lately for being a fearless, served and honestly, I didn't didn't even know anxiety waas to panic attacks in one day. Once that happened, it could stop it. Well, it makes sense of looking at being a surgeon as one of the ultimate suppressions of anxiety. And it worked until it didn't it didn't. It just exploded at a level I can put into words.

spk_0:   32:46
Yeah, I have two big questions. Sure, why this one's really big. The other one's about kids, because I'm sure I'm just trying to speak for the for the people in the room that might have these questions later. So if I mean, some people may not find this up in, you know, these you're you're conclusions here popular. I do. But for this, for those people who think well, no, it's more to it than us. Why is anxiety so much more prevalent now than it seems like it used to be? Do you think it was always there and we just are more aware of it now? We're just giving it more discussion now I'm just curious, you know, just big question big like question out there,

spk_1:   33:25
you know, it's definitely worth I mean, the incident. Chronic pain, which he had. The mental pains appear problem creating physical senses. But the instance of chronic pain in Atlantis has gone up over 800% in 10 years. I mean it, Dad is right there. It's not. It's not a problem. Well, right, So I think right now it's a century overload. And so I think that one of the ways the brain develops is to play. And of course, we've gone from, You know, when I was a kid, I went to one of the touch my pleasure ships in the world. I probably had four hours of homework a week. Now it's like three or four hours a day. So we're knocking Plato. People says I'm safe. The lack of plays a major factor. Cinema with play. There's a little book by Stuart Brown called Play. He goes into the neuroscience and play, but play does during the day with dreaming does at night sleep does at night for you, and so it helps you body language tone of voice negotiating skills. I mean, the way you learn how to live life functionally is where at play, when your front of a computer screen is two dimensional, three dimensional, you can learn how to interact with the people in front of a computer screen so that I think the 30 and computer screens are a massive problem. They're very addictive. We've seen all sorts of evidence. Now that texting is addicting is drinking or drugs, it's just flat out addicting. And so again, that's a whole thing about anxiety. So you have this elevated alertness was coming next. Of course, the bullying factor is a massively huge problem would take a time out for a long time, but we're being century overloaded. We're also be get. Which on is that we have opportunity now than we've ever had in our lifetimes. But expectations are so much higher, so these unreachable expectations are a problem, I'll say from a parenting stamp on. It took me a long time to figure this out, but I did that. You have to really allow your kids to feel and on their failures because it can only on their success is not safe on their failures, and you just have to teach kids. Hunter fails. Do you snow skid off the champs?

spk_0:   35:21
Do I do what?

spk_1:   35:22
Snow skiing Mesquite?

spk_0:   35:23
Oh yeah, we do quite a bit.

spk_1:   35:25
So they never one thing have to do with skin has learned how to stop.

spk_0:   35:28
You

spk_1:   35:29
have to be able to control your speed and with kids ever learn how to deal with adversity has had to learn how to fail and by being a helicopter parent, trying overprotective of him the best they could be in whatever it is, they don't own it anymore. And so you know, it's a major problem. But again, the huge to hear is that all kids ranges and by we're not teaching the scales rashly. In fact, none of us really be talking skills at an early age. I just started our profit years ago. Trump with these things right into the classroom, starting right. They're in first grade, but its own currency artist to start the simple exercise called message writing. Have your kids do it, and I had a friend of my head first grade teacher who started doing it for the year and their parents to come ask your ago. What's going on? My kid's behavior has calmed down, but again it's over. 1000 readers papers, a document that is somehow breaks up these spinning circuits in your brain and disrupts the patterns. It's not psychological assistance. Separation process from your thoughts, but go to my website again. On stage. When there's five stabs, you have to look a little bit to find the family link. But there's a whole a bunch of concepts. Resource is around. The family, it was trying to say before I interrupted myself, is that family is the most powerful tool keeping people in pain but conversely, has been unbelievable. How powerful it is about pulling people out of pain is numbly level.

spk_0:   36:56
That's a big point right there, right? Like people see as the source. But it's also the exit as well. It depends on how you how you, you know, this would be the most perfect ending. But I just have to ask another question. Sure. Um, the question is, Dr Hans, come, Did your kids have to clean their room? And did they listen really well, I know. I'm asking. I'm asking a little technical question and you've given us this beautiful stand back. So I hope I made someone laugh right there. But let's talk. Let me just ask you about some everyday mechanics. Uh, you know, do you just let it go? Like, because if you don't want to have conflict, but you want something to be done, do you just treat it like a business, right? Do you just take it to the family meeting like, Well, I didn't get this Didn't get this job done in the business. So you know, it doesn't equate to allowance or or what do you think they're

spk_1:   37:45
well again? It's not about permissive parenting at all. I could S o occurs the audience like this, but called parent Effectiveness Training by Dr Thomas Gordon. It was written in the seventies when it just completely changes the relationship between union Child. So I'm gonna go human to human in What's going on is that you just simply negotiate. So the answer was that didn't have problems with that. And if he came in after curfew, so they always do what the consequences were ahead of time. Wasn't even a punch with a okay. You shopped till one o'clock in the morning is going to be home at 11. Guess what? You just have to go out tomorrow night. So what's even an argument just happened. So it's not about giving people pressure doing they want to do. And so I won't go on a two person to deal here. But what I would do a create expectations. So we do this this and this tonic and what parents forget begin if they're not being triggered by their parents. I was very anxious, angry? Guess where? You're kidding me. Anxious and angry you get into this reactive mode, actually can't solve the problems that probably somewhere there cleaning in the room or not, is the interaction that starts beforehand. So if you're coming out of 1/3 tour, I mean that it was like to be told what to do, right? You know, if I told you. Okay, so your kids don't either.

spk_0:   38:52
Yeah, I hate it. Right.

spk_1:   38:54
So So that's so talented, kid. To clean the robe and put you in a 38 a parent kid relationship. The P T. Philosophy completely levels the playing field. It just always issue become not issues. I can't. I just It's been really transforming from Amazon. Everyone book that changed my life was that book. I have read it at least 20 times. If they started going sideways to my family, actually, just create the book up again. And he's a child psychiatrist. It is. One of those books is so brilliant that I couldn't believe it had to read the breed. This specter figure out what he was saying. He was so clear.

spk_0:   39:30
You were You were saying something You said about you. You're reacting. I was writing down that I missed it. You basically saying you're you're spinning in circles, you know, if yeah,

spk_1:   39:40
it is cosmic because this universal ping pong game going that you can't stop. So you're going back to the more practical part of it. So let's be having a bad day at work. You doctor claims Jenner who's pissed you off. Don't walk in the door of your house. Just don't come in the house. Don't do it. Because why? If you're in a bad mood, why you gonna bring it home? Why you gonna bring that cloud of negative energy into the room?

spk_0:   40:03
Yeah. Go to the garage,

spk_1:   40:05
go to the garage. You know just take a walk, drive around whatever you need to do to not come home and see things appear. So I come home 99 20 times and I'm fine. But you probably know that intermittent reinforcement is a much bigger issue than assistant reinforcement. Other words, usually fishing is so addictive because this instrument, we don't know when that fish is gonna hit or not going fishing at a trout farm where I should go in fishing in a while. So if we wanted to catch a fish every time we just go to the trout farm, right, So it's the intermittent reinforcement. Is that 1920 times? Marber. Dad is happy. Happy to see you and that 1 20 times you're in a bad mood and just snap it. You really not your fault. You don't know who's gonna walk through the door. You're just gonna make it absolute that you just don't want to the door of your bad mood. Just don't do it. You can't even mask it. I mean, you and I both know that you're in a bad mood. You can try to act happy, but you're not. And of course, a lot of this in a bad mood. We did use your families is the targets who is the least logical group to be your target? Because you have to live with them and you care for them. Why would you do that? Because we're triggered. And again it just overwhelms her rational brain.

spk_0:   41:20
Find your I think the endpoint there is if you are feeling elevated stress chemicals and you cannot control them and you become angry. Find the thing that UN does that thing. Find your happy tool or whatever, whether it's the walk, whether it's you know, whatever it is, right. So you can not come in the house. That angry person saying Come in the house, that happy person. And if you're happy, the world is good

spk_1:   41:45
or also remember, you need only suppress younger. That was your suppress anxiety. You don't suppress your anger because you've been sick. So I'm gonna ask you to be happy all the time that we actually be happy and things were bad. But you are just becoming aware of the influence of your anger on the people around you. They have us with people in this part of day and age were overwhelmed with everything we need to do. So think about how you actually come home and are excited to see our kids. What can we do together? Let's take a walk. Is grab those go bird watch or something together. We can't come home. Just go through the routine or just get through the evening. You're the horror and going to bed. That's not actually it's not life, I mean in this life. But it's not like it's not the life that you really want. So again, where were crushed by all these reactive patterns? We actually losing creativity in which you wonder, is come home. And that's where the family means coming to placing. And these also addresses on the website. But there's lost things you could do, which it can't do with anger is that you can't talk it up. That's what they did. You can't do right,

spk_0:   42:43
right? So and the other thing about this is, I can hear, you know, as I'm saying, Well, what if that's what if this one of this, if you're reacting, you're losing the creativity like that? I like that concept there because it would be easy for someone to say Dr David. I don't have time to go bird watching because I have to go home and cook and clean and bullet Bob. Well, that is a choice we can like. If we don't really like doing that, how do we work our way out of that? That's where you can stand back and say, How do I create something that works better? Right? I think there's always room to improve and create. You create the environment that you're standing, and once you realize that you know it, it allows you to, you know, point point that cause inward, right? Like I gives you ultimate control.

spk_1:   43:25
We'll take the word reactive attachment when you're reactive way you just It's not a great place to be right. Take the letter C and put it at the beginning of the word. Where do you get creative? Creative, right, So he can see First I was creating a bit of a spaceman with neural plasticity Is awareness separation reprogramming. So if you change, take that deep breath. Okay? My behavior is creating this effect of my family. I don't want to do that so you can see first. Then you could be creative if he reacted in course, gratuity just disappears.

spk_0:   43:58
Yeah, I like a girl toe. Cool tool. See first, and then you won't have to be reactive. You could be great. Well, I really enjoyed that. I was a fun, different concept is just It's just good thing this affects everyone. So this is one of those great episodes that you should share with your family. Share with your loved one share with your mother in law and then go over to the website and talk into the speak pipe. You can click on that, or you can send us an email. Hello, Less stress life. And let us know how you like this episode. Leave a review below and we can't wait to come back and talk to you next week. One of the best gift you could give us at the less stress life is your feedback. We are paid in podcast reviews. If you enjoyed this or any other episode, please leave us a review in the iTunes store or from your podcast app. Just search for less dressed life as if you're not already subscribed. Click on the banana face image scroll to the bottom where it shows the text of other reviews and write a review while you're there. Hey, make sure you hit Subscribe for Android or stitcher users. You gotta go to the desktop site and search for less dress life and then scroll down to leave a review. Stitcher doesn't load Apple reviews on their site, so if you want, you can leave a review in both places. Your feedback means a lot to the success of the show. Thanks so much for taking the time to do that, you rock.